Lap times, anyone RT owner done a track day?

[Mick]

After trying to find a true comparison, RT Vs 4 wheels, I am still at a loss for an answer that satisfies me?
I have been a kit car enthusiast since the early 80s, buying the then UK mag, kit cars and specials, always interested 
in reverse trikes, big claims and quirky. My favourites, the Badsey Bullet, futuristic styling at the time, engine between the front axle, rear drive, claimed to outhandle a Ferrari!! Triking superlight, they managed to lose 200 pounds from an already 'slim' 780 pounds and gave it a 100hp tunes Guzzi V lump!!! Triking still going strong in the UK after all these years. I remember a Kit car article about a track day and this little Triking was overtaking 400hp Cobra replicas  'ON THE INSIDE LINE' !!!!! 
So what am I going on about?........
how about some lap times that you have personally done or know of someone that has done, name the circuit, RT lap times and lap times of others, maybe Lotus 7 replicas, other kit cars, hot hatches, or production sports cars maybe........

[Liteway]

Apr 21, 2016 14:47:27 GMT -5 Mick said:

After trying to find a true comparison, RT Vs 4 wheels, I am still at a loss for an answer that satisfies me?
I have been a kit car enthusiast since the early 80s, buying the then UK mag, kit cars and specials, always interested 
in reverse trikes, big claims and quirky. My favourites, the Badsey Bullet, futuristic styling at the time, engine between the front axle, rear drive, claimed to outhandle a Ferrari!! Triking superlight, they managed to lose 200 pounds from an already 'slim' 780 pounds and gave it a 100hp tunes Guzzi V lump!!! Triking still going strong in the UK after all these years. I remember a Kit car article about a track day and this little Triking was overtaking 400hp Cobra replicas  'ON THE INSIDE LINE' !!!!! 
So what am I going on about?........
how about some lap times that you have personally done or know of someone that has done, name the circuit, RT lap times and lap times of others, maybe Lotus 7 replicas, other kit cars, hot hatches, or production sports cars maybe........

Hallet Raceway is about 90mins away from me. I have sent them a couple of emails asking what their policy is regarding trikes for "High Speed Touring" days but I cannot get a reply.
Based on street experience, I think I would lose ground coming out of corners because power has to applied more carefully to avoid a spin. Braking is not likely to get any of that back because of my particular trike's small front discs,
I should be strongest on the straights, but no better than a 4 wheeled car with a similar pwr/wt ratio.
Having said all that, I'd love to get the chance to try to prove myself wrong, and having a legal place to test limits would be a blast.
I will post results, good or bad if I can get it done.


Read more: reversetrike.proboards.com/thread/619/proper-comparison-3-wheels-4#ixzz46YoV1zH3

[Liteway]

Both trike and driver appear pretty capable.

I posted this on another thread, but for those who would like a more detailed look at the trike

www.facebook.com/TWS-Racing-The-Wooden-Stash-525059027571284/?ref=aymt_homepage_panel

[2rike]

The thing with track days is, they are not races and you often get held up by back markers and or different types of cars so it is hard to do any proper lap times unless you hire the track for your own use.
I think if you look at hillclimbs or sprints such as Harewood hillclimb (in the UK) you can get the times for different category of cars or single seaters so you could compare the type of  time or coarse record.
Back in the late ninties I used to hillclimb an old Formula-Ford single seater with a 1000 cc Yamaha FZR engine in it, in the racing car under 1100 cc class " I "
This was a very similar set up to my 2rike  and it weighs exactly the same as my trike at 360 KG
To be honest the laws of physics would dictate that the four wheeled machine would win out every time when you are on the very ragged edge of grip and traction  
My fastest time was 57.33 seconds which back in the day was about 3 seconds off the class record. I hope to take the 2rike there later in the year and have ago and then we can compare 
There is a hillclimb association for motorcycles and three wheelers, and they visit harewood on one of their championship rounds so there should be results for trikes up Harewood
I think the FRS 3 wheeler has the coarse record at about  62 seconds but that looked to be in road going trim,  so what type of car do you want to compare it too?

 

[Mick]

Now that RT in the video clips is moving..............home made RT catching and overtaking Lotus and Xbox, hats off to the bloke!
Would be good to see your times up the hill comparing your formula ford with your amazing RT, although your formula Ford is an outright race car and your RT is road going. Still curious if you could get within a couple of seconds maybe??
James how is the bodywork coming on? You've done the hard bit!

[captainamerica]

While I can appreciate what hes doing, and his setup actually looks quite nicely done, I will say that in my experience at the local autocross I was 10 seconds off the pace of the other cars. Reasoning, I didn't do a lot of setup for speed on the day in question, I need to be able to dial in more camber but my current steering links won't allow me to shorten the upper A-arm at all. Mostly though I felt like turn in was really slow, and I had to stay off the throttle through the corner to stop from losing the rear end, the only place I gained was in acceleration. Even with setup changes I don't think a trike will be able to keep up with a competent driver in a competent car, we win in power to weight up to a certain speed but the cornering without the ability to plant the rear end will get beat every time. Still a lot of fun, and I would do it again in a heart beat, but I want to make a bolt on formula car rear end I can use for track days.

At the drag strip my off the line time sucks but once I get to 6-8mph I can just keep the power down and never lift even through the shift from 1st to 2nd and catch and beat people but I am always coming from behind because of the lack of rear traction. Me and my roommate went out to the 1/8th mile we live near on grudge night, him in his leased mercedes turbo 4 banger and he beat me 4-5times, the only time I got him was when I rode the clutch through about 20mph to stop from losing the rear at the line.

[Liteway]

Finally got a reply back from Hallet raceway. I made it clear I was interested in track time only and included pictures and description of my trike.
They replied that they do not yet have a class for "Slingshots", but to check back next racing season.
Bugger.

Might be a comical sight, but I relish the thought of skittering around amongst a group of Slingshots.

A whippet in a buffalo herd or a hyena caught in a pride of lions?

[DaveJ98092]

I think if you were to put on some sticky tires all around and adjust your weight distribution and suspension settings for a TRACK day, you'd smoke most Slingshot drivers. Even with your 600cc engine, I'd bet you have a better power to weight ratio. And a hell of a lot less aero drag. Might have to put your "Fighter Wings" back on.

Ask if they would allow an "Exhibition Class" of just trikes. No prize's, just for SHOW in between races.

[Liteway]

Contact patches are already generous for the vehicle weight and stickier tires are not a practical or maybe even necessary option given chain clearance at the rear and wheel limitations.

I have noticed that dropping the trike on its suspension an inch and a half or so (takes about an hour) makes a noticeable improvement in overall stability but 3" of clearance on the street does not work out so good. That and higher tire pressures and spring preload are all I would likely change for track work. Handling is pretty neutral and easily balanced with the throttle, so I think the 53/47 weight distribution is a good compromise. More weight forward; less traction, more understeer. More rearward; less stability.

I do wonder how more weight on the rear might affect corner exit. On the one hand, traction might be improved allowing more power to be applied without slipping, but stability is likely to be negatively affected with extra load on the end with no roll resistance.

My own personal highly questionable and unscientific theory is , so long as you can keep both front wheels stuck to the track on corner exit, you do not have too much weight at the rear.

[DaveJ98092]

I "Worked" in Redmond Washington, land of the "Microsoft Millionaires". I got to see so many Exotic cars and trikes while working on customers ADSL and phone lines. Some of the most "SuperCars" are daily drivers. There are more used Slingshots for sale up here than anywhere else when I do a Ebay or Craigslist search. The owners seem to "Grow Old" of them quickly when you have big bucks to throw around. Them and Can-Am Spyders.

[Mick]

Wonder if a super sticky back tyre would help with corner exit? Great that the race circuit got back to you with and answer.
Remember your helmet cam!