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Post by skifffz1to3 on Mar 2, 2015 0:49:11 GMT -5
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Post by skifffz1to3 on Mar 2, 2015 1:11:49 GMT -5
My shop Logo I drew up back in 1989 and me hamming it up in the finished XXX-Fusion "tub". Now we marry the tub to the bike frame...let the fun begin.
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Post by DaveJ98092 on Mar 3, 2015 20:33:31 GMT -5
Sure would like to see what you get in the kit. And what you must supply that does not come with the kit.
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Post by skifffz1to3 on Mar 4, 2015 2:21:43 GMT -5
I'll be glad to help with that info....as soon as mine gets here...ship docking delay due to strike on dock...New delivery date 3/20. Something that will not be a problem with future orders.
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Post by skifffz1to3 on Mar 7, 2015 1:12:42 GMT -5
Fixed the pics, more to follow soon.
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Post by mtntech on May 2, 2015 10:02:44 GMT -5
You should start a build thread in the Build subforum.
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Post by skifffz1to3 on Nov 9, 2015 21:18:56 GMT -5
Hey, I'm back. Still at it...slowly. I could use some advise on forward positioned radiators. I have a new VW Rabbit radiator that fits perfectly up front of the steering rack and pedals. Are there any cautions or tips as I move forward with this phase?
My donor bike is a FZ1 (1000)
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Post by DaveJ98092 on Nov 9, 2015 23:52:01 GMT -5
Ducting that hot air is the biggest concern. It has to be ducted away from the rider ether under, over or to the sides. You can add some small sealed vents for those cold mornings but the normal amount (100%) of heat off that radiator will bake you even on a cold day. Its at about 180 degrees F or higher on a hot day. At the highest point of the system you must have a "Burp" outlet to get the trapped air out. I'd do the overflow port there too with a radiator cap for topping off and pressure relief to the overflow bottle. And do the coolant fill with Evans waterless coolant. You must get all the old water out of the engine for this to work. It costs $46 for a gallon but it will never boil out. www.summitracing.com/parts/evn-ec61001/overview/
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Post by Liteway on Nov 10, 2015 0:50:26 GMT -5
Hey, I'm back. Still at it...slowly. I could use some advise on forward positioned radiators. I have a new VW Rabbit radiator that fits perfectly up front of the steering rack and pedals. Are there any cautions or tips as I move forward with this phase? My donor bike is a FZ1 (1000) I've done a lot of experimenting with this. Air exiting the core must be carefully managed to avoid catching heat in the cockpit or your face but front mounting is the way to go. Mine vents through "gills" in a low pressure area behind the front spoiler and on top of the nose just behind the radiator, but well ahead of the windshield. The hood vent can be closed with a dash control to reroute heated air directly into the footbox by means of a flapper. This provides an effective heater, something that would be hard to achieve with a rear mounted radiator. Insulate the plumbing if routed through the cockpit and make sure your forward bulkhead/firewall seals well and is also well insulated. You in business. I don't catch nearly as much summer heat as I did riding bikes. Rabbit radiator is probably way overkill, but if you got space, why not. I Use the stock bike radiator with an intake about 4" by 7". I think the bike radiator is relatively oversized because the air stream is blocked by the front wheel and fender. Thermostatically controlled fan on the trike that kicks in at 200 doesn't activate nearly so often as water cooled bikes I've owned. This is whats under the scoop. In heater mode,flap is up and seals against the underside of the scoop effectively making it a duct from the radiator outlet hole ahead of the firewall to the footbox below the flap and behind the firewall.When the flap is dropped,radiator is vented out the back of the reverse scoop to the outside air stream. gill vents Flapper up, heater mode.
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Post by skifffz1to3 on Nov 10, 2015 2:00:05 GMT -5
Thanks for the quick replies fellas. Just got in from the welding shop...she's on wheels now!
Yes, planning on keeping the stock thermostat/fill port as is...highest point from which to burp/bleed off air. Waterless, is the way to go.
I may rethink the Rabbit rad, my stock one is in tact, may be start with that, move to larger if needed.
pics when i slow down enough...
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Post by tripod1 on Nov 13, 2015 19:58:41 GMT -5
Hi Budd, Congratulations on getting it on its wheels!! When I designed the original Tri Pod I thought long and hard about radiator placement (actually I thought long and hard about most aspects of the design) and I ended up putting it where it is in the kits for the following reasons (in no particular order). 1) Packaging - it fits and doesn't remove handy storage space or legroom up front. 2) Plumbing - Nice short runs of pipe and the bare minimum possibility of air locks and overheating from a poorly bled coolant system. 3) Heat in the cockpit - Yes some warm air vacuums into the cockpit over the driver and passengers shoulder but it beats the hell out of the likely heatsoak caused by placing it up front. Of course where I live half of the year is very humid and around 90F. If I go for a drive further south or west (I would never go north in summer, its like Florida...) it gets hotter (100 - 115F) The winters are not that cold on the other hand I haven't felt a strong need for a heater but there have been a few drives where it would have been appreciated. The thought of sitting in traffic, in summer, with the rad fan running and a percentage of that heat hitting me.... Not good. 4) I wanted smooth aero at the front with no intake/grille. Many have asked how does the Tri Pods cooling system work? The same as any other one really. Yes the radiator is hidden away but if you have a higher pressure on the front of the core than the rear, air passes through. You don't need an enormous blast of air hitting the front face of it for the concept to work. My V twin original prototype has been driven on 45c days with the air temp at road level being probably more like 55c and the water temp around 103c. On normal days it sits between fully open thermostat temp (low 80s c) and low 90s. Other cars built by customers to our spec such as the two Bandit 1250s sit around 100c most of the time or a bit under as from memory the thermostat doesn't fully open till 95c and the fan is programmed to come on at 102 or 103c. A customer recently thrashed his around a local race track and didn't get any warmer than that. Bandits run hot, maybe explaining why Suzuki don't fit a temp gauge at the factory. There are a few caveats to the design working - 1) The radiator must be almost completely baffled off. ie front higher pressure air must be sealed off from the lower pressure on the other side of the core (yeah I know, obvious...). 2) The sidepod air intake is not sufficient on its own (in my opinion and experience). We suggest a NACA style duct in the floor as well in front of where the rad mounts in the rear bulkhead. 3) We suggest an adjustable 'scoop' be mounted at the trailing edge of the naca duct to help it along fr those truly hot days when max performance of the radiator is required. 4) A fan be fitted as below 30 odd MPH the system doesn't function terribly well. So not a perfect system but for me a simpler and cooler choice. Nothing beats the ease of getting air into a front mounted rad but mid engined cars are difficult to cool and history shows us many examples of how not to do it. Regards, Andrew.
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Post by Liteway on Nov 14, 2015 10:11:08 GMT -5
Love the tripod, Andrew. May be the slickest looking trike anywhere. Have to disagree about the inherent cokpit heat problems of a front mounted radiator though. After some refinement, the problem simply does not exist on my trike. You are right about the simpler plumbing afforded by rear mounting and you make other valid points about various pitfalls and complexities of front mounted radiators. Yet another problem to consider, the routing of the pipes. I first tried to do this going underneath, but what may have been obvious to some, their vulnerability, I had to learn the hard way before running them along the floor of the cokpit. There, they compete for space with various mechanical bits and need to be shielded both to prevent heat in the cokpit and possible scalding of the driver in a mishap. Nonetheless, these problems are not so difficult to solve and the huge advantage of affording a means of cokpit heating makes the extra effort required more than worth it, if not for you guys in year round warm climates at least for us in the more temperate zones. Here in Okla, most folks tend to winterize their bikes and wheel them to the back of the garage from the end to November to middle of march. Not me buddy. The average daytime high here in Jan is 45 degrees (f), and I can manage that fine in a windbreaker and light gloves, the lower body, and most importantly, the feet staying nice and toasty. The wind protection afforded by the cowl and windscreen even allow a slight warm draft to be felt seeping up under the edge of a full face helmet. Now if I can just perfect A.C., ha ha. I do not have the backdraft problem you describe for the tripod. As you can see, the driver is shielded as effectively from the back as the front. That kind of solution may not be easily applied to a side by side and a back screen may detract from the slick looks. A flat plexi or Lexan screen perhaps? That should also make an effective noise shield. What do you think? You could frame it with a full width roll bar, improving safety as well. Also note the very small and adjustable radiator opening . The angle of the door here only provides a slight opening that's gives plenty of cooling to operate to 85 or 90 degrees f ambient, then I just pop it open a bit more. Not much drag here. Honestly,I think I could get by with a permanent opening no bigger than a mail slot, such is the efficiency using high pressure air at the nose with proper scavenging behind the radiator. This photo was made before the installation of a wider deeper air dam and the gill vents it allowed. At that time I was using a vent that dumped underneath but that is a whole nother story. Not really a packaging problem either, just a little extra crush space. Note the gaskets at the top of firewall and foil insulation. I do apologize to you veterans on the site for the rehash of some of my old photos and ideas, but maybe some of new guys will get something out of it.
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Post by Liteway on Nov 15, 2015 10:04:33 GMT -5
Ducting that hot air is the biggest concern. It has to be ducted away from the rider ether under, over or to the sides. You can add some small sealed vents for those cold mornings but the normal amount (100%) of heat off that radiator will bake you even on a cold day. Its at about 180 degrees F or higher on a hot day. At the highest point of the system you must have a "Burp" outlet to get the trapped air out. I'd do the overflow port there too with a radiator cap for topping off and pressure relief to the overflow bottle. And do the coolant fill with Evans waterless coolant. You must get all the old water out of the engine for this to work. It costs $46 for a gallon but it will never boil out. www.summitracing.com/parts/evn-ec61001/overview/Good info about the burp point and waterless coolant Dave. However, I did not find it necessary to move the pressure cap to the high point in the system. Its still down there on the radiator, responding to pressure the same as it would anywhere in the loop, with overflow and recovery working normally. My radiator is not readily accessible, but the burp point and overflow tanks are, so that's where levels are monitored and topped. I do see a potential problem here as air in the system may not be forced out before fluid,making it important to keep something in the overflow tank at all times or air will suck in that won't be expelled in the next cycle. Doing this, the system has worked without a glitch for 5 years. I just check the burp port now and then as air in the system should show up there. Never see any. My trike usually runs 70 80 c and initially I though that might be too low and changed out the thermostat but got no change. Did some research on the net and found the donor bike runs the same, so I guess that's what Yamaha wants. Later Edit. As I read this over later, You're right. Pressure cap should be at the top of the system. Sounds as though I have gotten away with half-as-ing it.
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Post by skifffz1to3 on Nov 16, 2015 3:53:10 GMT -5
Thanks for the replies. Andrew, i do understand your point...and your experience is beyond question. But (like TT) I did, and will be again, a year-round rider. Keep in mind that the day of my near fatal crash, 02012014, it was 37 degrees F when I departed for work..my trusty steed had 137k on the clock (you don't rack up those miles "fair weather riding". Now, 2k miles on back as pillion and almost 2 years later, I have become more sensitive to colder temps. The forward mounted rad is more important to my future of riding than the potential pitfalls mentioned...I'll work them out, somehow. I decided to keep the OEM rad rather tan the overkill vw donor.
My project Manager (son) and I have decided not to distribute many ongoing build pics. We will release a full video, including hundreds of 30-60 sec freeze frame shots near completion of the build. Our new projected reveal date will be March 2016 at Daytona Bike Week...hopefully along with my friend at Brian Ball Motorsports. Brian, unlike me, is building a complete original TriPod1 kit.
Cheers
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Post by tripod1 on Nov 17, 2015 15:38:38 GMT -5
I'm with you Budd. Last time I drove the orange prototype in freezing conditions I certainly wished for a heater. I think my point is though that you can add a heater unit and maybe have easier control over cockpit temps and smaller sized plumbing to the heater unit than you need to the rad.
Original rad will be enough if mounted in a fresh blast of air at the front while being appropriately baffled.
My intention is to bring over a completed and registered Tri Pod 1 early next year but will miss Daytona. Intending to drive it across country and catch up with you. You can lead out on your favourite roads!
Enjoy the build, Regards, Andrew.
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Post by skifffz1to3 on Nov 17, 2015 23:11:14 GMT -5
Cool news Andrew. BTW please reset my TriPod forum password...one more time!
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Post by skifffz1to3 on May 24, 2016 11:28:34 GMT -5
I'm here, so far...WOW, life keeps throwing those curve balls, I keep swinging. With the (many) wrist surgeries (8 so far, and #9 coming up jun 9th), add trying to work when I'm able, life, life, life. Sure thought I'd be done and riding by now! This next phase I'm working out the specifics of my driver's seat. steering column, pedals and finally the floor pan and dash (fabbing my own dash) . Then the engine goes back in, cable, controls and wiring harness. More work is needed on the aft side gas tank/engine cover to FZ1's tail section. Paint or body wrap. Then, tires, brakes...anything else needed to ride...
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